I have to admit watching this “discussion” over the who, what, when, where and how of the shooting of Trayvon Martin by George Zimmerman with disgust. I refrained from commenting on it when it first hit the news because I have learned enough over the years to recognize stories where one needs to let it develop a bit for all the facts to come out.
Of course that didn’t at all stop the usual suspects from pouncing on what seemed a perfect story with which they could push their favorite racial themes (Jesse Jackson’s “Blacks are under attack” for instance) and for others to involve themselves in something that they really have no business involving themselves in.
It has laid bare the polarization within this country and how extreme it has become.
The story, if you’ve taken time to research it, is nothing like the cut and dried “whitey killed a black man because he was black” meme the race baiters are pushing. In fact, if you’ve bothered to research the story, it appears that race had little if anything to do with this tragedy. It is not a racial issue, even if it has been portrayed as such by the Al Sharptons, Jesse Jacksons and Louis Farrakhans of this world.
George Zimmerman, if anything, appears to have been an overzealous neighborhood watch person with a history of calling in suspicious activities he saw in his neighborhood. Treyvan Martin, who lived 250 miles away from that neighborhood, was apparently acting suspiciously (rummaging through garbage cans, etc.) when Zimmerman spotted him. I doubt that Zimmerman cared one whit what Martin’s skin color was at the time. Apparently somewhere during that time, a confrontation took place, a fight ensued and Zimmerman killed Martin with a shot to the chest.
A witness has come forward saying he saw Martin on top of Zimmerman punching him in the face. Martin, aged 17 and 6 foot 3, was not the innocent “child” the much media has tried to portray. He was a probably bigger than Zimmerman and was on a 10 day suspension from school. Obviously that doesn’t justify killing him but it sheds a little different light on the outcome.
I can’t get inside the heads of either of these people but is it reasonable to assume, given the situation, that Zimmerman might have feared for his life? Possibly. I don’t know – and neither does anyone else.
Does that justify the shooting. Again, I don’t know.
But of course all the race pimps do. Just ask them. And so they’ve essentially initiated a vendetta against George Zimmerman, who, by the way, isn’t white even though that assumption was immediately made by many given his name. Zimmerman’s mother is Peruvian and of Indian stock.
An example of the thoughtless incitement that is going on can be found with none other than Spike Lee who, uninformed jerk that he is, published Zimmerman’s address on Twitter. Numerous threats to Zimmerman have been published on Twitter as well. The New Black Panthers have put a $10,000 bounty on Zimmerman’s head. Louis Farrakhan tweeted that the “law of retribution may soon be applied”, a not-so-veiled threat against Zimmerman.
The irony, of course, is this is a typical lynch mob mentality being stirred up here. These are calls for violence outside the law.
No one is claiming that George Zimmerman isn’t at fault here. He may very well be. We don’t know yet. That’s for a court of his peers to decide. Certainly not a marginally informed and inflamed mob. If something happens to Zimmerman before his day in court, you can most likely look to the digital lynch mob for the source. I’ve always considered the racist white lynch mobs of the past to be one of the most horrific and disgusting manifestations of the racism of the past. I find what is happening now no less horrific or disgusting.
There’s also another reason this is on the national radar. And it has nothing to do with race. I’ll let my favorite leftist hack columnist at the New York Times lay it out for you:
Florida’s now-infamous Stand Your Ground law, which lets you shoot someone you consider threatening without facing arrest, let alone prosecution, sounds crazy — and it is. And it’s tempting to dismiss this law as the work of ignorant yahoos. But similar laws have been pushed across the nation, not by ignorant yahoos but by big corporations.
If you are inclined to want to see guns controlled or banned and citizens required to flee any sort of confrontation vs. defending themselves, Paul Krugman is right there with you and has the goods on this now “infamous” law.
Except, as usual, it is a mish-mash of half-truths and innuendo cobbled together to make you think that corporate America is actually the villain in all of this.
We talked about this case on the podcast last night. What is going on right now is all too predictable. And it again points out how polarized this country is. And it isn’t getting less polarized.
Final thought. As I recall, President Obama was supposed to be the “post-racial” President, or that was his claim. Yet he has inserted himself in two local incidents that I know of (the Skip Gates incident being the first) and inflamed the incidents with his remarks. That, my friends, is not leadership.
But then, he’s not a leader, and those of us who have actually been in leadership positions in our lives have known that from the beginning. Instead he has difficulty denying his liberal roots and not succumbing to their siren call.
He’s an agitator. And, as usual, he’s stepped in on something he should have stayed out of and made it far worse. Inserting himself has given impetus, cover and justification for the Frarrakhans, Lees, Jacksons, Sharptons and the New Black Panthers to do what they’re doing. Instead of calming the waters and talking about trusting the legal system and letting it do its work, he’s done exactly the opposite.
Congrats, Mr. Prez. If anything happens to Zimmerman, you’re on the hook too as far as I’m concerned.
~McQ
Twitter: @McQandO
UPDATE: On Lawful Arrest.
Arrest is the taking of a person into lawful custody. The operative word in that sentence is LAWFUL. The police at this point CANNOT arrest Zimmerman without an arrest warrant having been issued. He is protected by the Fourth Amendment, which prohibits the government from making an unreasonable seizure of a person (an arrest) without a warrant, issued under probable cause. The ability for cops to arrest based on probable cause is an EXCEPTION to the warrant rule, held by the courts to be a ‘reasonable’ seizure without a warrant if founded in exigent circumstances.
The Fifth Amendment also comes into play, wherein nobody may not be held to answer for a “capital or otherwise infamous crime” except upon indictment by a Grand Jury (when a DA charges a crime, the indictment is at some point rubber-stamped by a Grand Jury), nor shall any person be deprived of their liberty without due process of law.
What this means in practical terms is that officers can arrest without a warrant for probable cause WHEN THE ARREST IS MADE AS A MATTER OF EXIGENT CIRCUMSTANCE. Put in plain language, that means it has to pretty much be done contemporaneously with the initial investigation of the crime….. and additional criteria must be met for the arrest to be legal. There has to be probable cause to believe a crime has been committed (i.e. that ALL of the specific elements outlined in the code which defines the crime have been met and that the person being arrested is the person who met them).
Where there is doubt in the minds of the police as to whether or not a crime was committed, the proper way to proceed is to investigate and submit the product of the investigation to the DA….. NOT to arrest.
More:
If Martin escalated the verbal altercation to physical violence by punching Zimmerman in the nose, it was Martin that escalated the conflict and became the aggressor. At that point, however, he was only guilty (If Zimmerman’s story is true) of something of the level of misdemeanor aggravated assault charge, and it considering the situation, he might be forgiven for even that small sin.
If Martin then mounted a downed Zimmerman and began trying to smash his head into the sidewalk as alleged, however, he dramatically upped the stakes.
Using the sidewalk as a weapon is legally (and lethally) every bit as bad as trying to smash in Zimmerman’s head with a brick. If this is what occurred, Martin was in the act of assaulting George Zimmerman with a deadly weapon. His actions were no longer remotely defensive in nature, but an offensive, potentially deadly attack. He is in the process of what a reasonable man may judge as attempted murder. Trayvon Martin was no longer a victim at this point, he was the attacker, and potentially a murderer.
At that point, George Zimmerman has the legal and moral right to defend himself. From a use-of-force perspective, everything that happened prior to that point is irrelevant. If Zimmerman had a reasonable suspicion that his life was in danger–and someone trying to smash your head open on concrete is a “reasonable suspicion” as a matter of legal opinion–then Zimmerman would have been justified in taken action to stop the potentially lethal attack initiated and pursued by Trayvon Martin.
There is a difference between what is legally right, and what is morally right. Zimmerman might have shown morally questionable judgement in leaving his vehicle to follow Martin, setting the stage for the verbal confrontation, and potentially the physical confrontation. He did not break any laws or violate a legal order in doing so, it just wasn’t very smart.
UPDATE (JM): The Conservatory coverage:
Anderson Cooper Interviews Zimmerman Neighbor—Plus, the Missing Verbiage from the 9-1-1 Call
ABC’s Original Unenhanced Zimmerman Footage
Spike Lee Apologizes to His Own Victims
Did ABC Obscure Zimmerman Injuries?
Denouncing “Trial by Media” While Conducting a Trial by Media
EBL on March 26, 2012 at 11:43 am said:
It does not help when Rick Santorum declares George Zimmerman “malicious” based his gut.
BEB on April 1, 2012 at 4:49 pm said:
It also doesn’t help that the kid was only armed with candy, tea, and a cell phone…none of which are “deadly”, and Zimmerman is 3 times his size. So, Zimmerman HAD to shoot him?? He could not have subdued him without killing him? I call bullshite! It doesn’t help that Zimmerman seemed (by his buddies) to be fixated on young black men.
This is ridiculous, this Stand Your Ground law has become nothing but legalized murder. I heard the phone call of the guy calling about a breaking and entering AT HIS NEIGHBOR’S HOUSE, the police telling him to stay in his own house, and this guy telling the police, in essence, that because of this law he has a right to kill these men that are not bothering HIM at all.
It is pathetic. Fla, IN, and all the other states that have this law need to rework it so it is understood by fools that you can not take the life of someone who is not threatening you. TRAYVON WAS ON HIS WAY HOME…HOME…REMEMBER THAT, and hope your child is not shot while on their way home…it could happen to them too.
Mel1264 on April 1, 2012 at 5:32 pm said:
You’re missing the point BEB. We don’t know the whole story so we can’t say what really happened. You don’t know if Zimmerman could have subdued him. Trayvon Martin was 6′ 3″. Zimmerman was NOT three times his size. If Martin came up from behind and started punching Zimmerman he could have easily gotten the upper hand. A witness saw Martin on top of Zimmerman. You don’t know what Travon was doing on his way home. Remember that. You haven’t heard all the accounts of what happened that day. Save your judgement until ALL of the facts have come out.
watch on April 2, 2012 at 2:35 am said:
try and watch…. 6 2 i hear ….zimmerman calls cops off duty ???? assault is the basis correct?? just curious why is it that whites have to worry bout thugs today you so like hos like that cant be trusted with felonies what
Shannon on April 3, 2012 at 8:23 am said:
Trayvon’s girlfriend was on the phone with him moments before he was killed, and she overheard the start of the conversation between Trayvon and George, which began with George asking Trayvon, “what are you doing around here?”. Still folks want to suggest that Trayvon tackled George from behind, even though he had been scared and FLEEING? Give me a break! Who is more likely to be lying, George, or Trayvon’s girlfriend? So a struggle ensued, and I don’t doubt that Trayvon hit George in the course of that struggle, but if I found myself confronted by a strange man I’d been fleeing from a he stalked me through the night, you can bet your ass I’d fight. Who wouldn’t? George should not have been following him. George should not have approached him. George followed and approached him. It’s a far more justified self defense to fight back against a stranger who has confronted you than it is to shoot the unarmed kid you confronted, because surprise surprise, he’s defending himself!
Dan Collins on April 3, 2012 at 8:25 am said:
There is evidence, Shannon. You might wish to acquaint yourself with it.
Mel1264 on April 3, 2012 at 11:38 am said:
Mr. Zimmerman had every right to ask Trayvon what he was doing in the neighborhood. He wasn’t a resident in the community and he had probably never seen him before. There had been several burglaries in the area and Zimmerman thought he looked suspicious. It has been reported that, at the time of the altercation, George Zimmerman had stopped following Trayvon and was on his way back to his car. It was at that point that Trayvon began to follow Zimmerman. If he was so afraid of Zimmerman, why wouldn’t he run as fast he could back to the apartment he was staying in? Instead he chose to go after him. That says to me that he was probably looking for trouble. There was no need for an altercation at that point. Zimmerman had retreated. He was no longer a threat. But for Trayvon following Zimmerman to his car, I’m guessing things would not have unfolded the way they did.
Chris on April 1, 2012 at 6:57 pm said:
“3 times his size”, BEB???
It is your understanding that Zimmerman is “3 times his size”???
I’m sorry. One more time for clarity: it is your belief that Trayvon Martin is “3 times” Zimmerman’s size? It is YOUR belief that Trayvon Martin is EIGHTEEN FOOT NINE INCHES TALL AND FOUR HUNDRED AND FIFTY POUNDS?
Forget “3 times his size”. Is George Zimmerman even Trayvon’s HEIGHT??
unreasonable facsimile on April 1, 2012 at 11:41 pm said:
I keep hearing this “armed only with Skittles, a cell phone and iced tea”. Did anyone hear George tell the dispatcher. “suspicious guy. looks like he’s up to no good..on drugs or something.it’s raining and he’s just walking around, looking about.” he’s just staring, looking at all the houses….now he’s just STARING AT ME. “I don’t know what his deal is” ”
GZ had to be asked to try and identify the race of the person (“looks black”, means, “I can’t be sure”). After Trayvon, seeing and knowing George was right there, TM advanced TOWARD GZ, while GZ was still in his vehicle. GZ made the positive id of “He’s a black male”….”somethings wrong with him, now he’s coming towards me…”coming to check me out” “he’s got his hands in his waistband”. Close enough for George to see a “button on his shirt”. Why would a “scared teenager” walk right toward someone they thought was a threat??? That makes no sense at all.
GZ had NO WAY OF KNOWING exactly what TM had on him. Ya’ll all act like TM walked up, said hello, flashed George the candy and tea, and walked away and then George shot him in the back.
George DID stop pursuing TM after telling the dispatcher “okay”. And just as a matter of semantics, the police did not “ORDER” George to stop pursuit. The DISPATCHER simply told him “we don’t need you to do that”. that is a FAR CRY from an ORDER TO STOP.
Get off your lazy butts, stop listening to the talking heads on TV and listen to the FULL series of 911 calls on the city of sanford website. they are free, as is the redacted initial police report. get your facts STRAIGHT instead of spewing out someone else’s vomit they haven’t even gotten right.
LAST….
GZ is approximately 5’8-9 inches tall, and the POLICE VIDEO DOES NOT SHOW A 250 LB MAN!!!! If George tops out at 175, I will be surprised. That means at best he had maybe 20-30 lbs on TM, and TM had at least 5 or 6 inches on him in height.
edna on April 2, 2012 at 7:36 am said:
I cannot believe that a witness actually saw TM on top of GZ doesn’t make any common sense. You have a gun, but someone is able to attack. In addition there is an eye witness walking his dog who clearly saw TM on the ground pleading for help, the pleading stop when TM was shot on the ground pleading for his life.
Connie on April 5, 2012 at 10:48 pm said:
Well done! Both the article and your post. So many misinformed, lazy people just want to react and spew meaningless words with little or no fact behind them. I am tired of hearing them drone on and on and on. These people don’t want truth OR justice; they can’t even be bothered to read the police report and the 911 call transcript. They just want people to think they are better than everyone else who isn’t ranting and spitting hatred. No black groups seem to be marching for the arrests of the Black Panthers for placing a hit on Zimmerman. Nor are they publicly criticizing Spike Lee for trying to get a nutcase to kill Zimmerman by putting his supposed address on Twitter. Justice? No, they want favor…regardless of the facts of the case…just because they are black and want retribution for past wrongs against people of their color. So we put a man in jail, even if the law says there isn’t enough evidence to convict him? How is this any different from the persecution of the blacks by the KKK? Both are despicable!
watch on April 2, 2012 at 2:42 am said:
It doesn’t help that profile is a bad word ……innate ability to survive is to assimmilate info ….you are more likely to be hurt in a black populous …..dor k
Antoine on April 3, 2012 at 11:24 am said:
The next story they right should be about Bruce McQuain. Dude listen to the 911 tape and this guy is not a racist. Come on man really!!!
Dan Collins on April 3, 2012 at 11:26 am said:
Somehow, his wife’s and his mentoring black youth not mentioned.
Mel1264 on April 3, 2012 at 11:44 am said:
Which 911 tapes are you referring to? NBC News has already admitted to altering the tapes from that night to make Zimmerman sound like a racist. After Zimmerman is asked by the 911 dispatcher whether Martin was black, white, or Hispanic, Zimmerman replies, “he looks black”. Listen to the tapes in their entirety before you start passing judgement. And don’t believe everything you hear from the mainstream media. They lie.
watch on April 2, 2012 at 2:23 am said:
profiling ? really ? whats the highest percentage in prison ? whats the highest percentage of families without fathers whats the highest percentage of muti babies with multi daddy jesus …….yo daddy helped with the breakbown of a beautiful society…. do nothing s we Have to help
watch on April 2, 2012 at 2:49 am said:
watch….. follow ,,,,aggression by t other dude was community watch off duty …. went to store …..what I hear saw kid ,,,, called …watched … why has girl not come forward??? why did detective ask for manslaughter and get refused by AT …. who did what wrong???? wait and see
Starless on March 26, 2012 at 1:38 pm said:
And we get to hear about “white hispanics”. A term which, AFA I understand it, is a made-up term created so the Census Bureau could pigeonhole some people into a nice, neat category and has almost nothing to do with reality. In the Spanish speaking world, there’s rubio and moreno and a wide spectrum in between, but I suppose that’s a bit too nuanced for racially motivated bureaucracy and NYT demagoguery.
jefferson101 on March 26, 2012 at 3:13 pm said:
I’m still holding to my original contention that Zimmerman is a nitwit at best. Had he stayed in his vehicle, none of this would have happened.
Nitwit, however, does not equal murderer. The whole situation is being exploited by the usual suspects to further their own ends. I suspect, though, that it will be completely off the radar in another week or so, once what actually happened comes out.
Starless on March 26, 2012 at 6:56 pm said:
Had he stayed in his vehicle, none of this would have happened.
Everything I’ve ever heard about neighborhood watch is that they’re supposed to observe and report, and that’s it. Therefore, either Zimmerman went against his training or he wasn’t properly trained in the first place. And he was armed.
off the radar in another week or so, once what actually happened comes out
Indeed. I wouldn’t wait for any sort of retraction or apology from Spike Lee, though.
jefferson101 on March 26, 2012 at 7:58 pm said:
Indeed. I wouldn’t wait for any sort of retraction or apology from Spike Lee, though.
One does have to wonder what the media reaction would be if the Aryan Nation offered a large reward for him. (I hate to even bring maggots like that up, but since Spike is already playing in the slime…..)
Regarding Zimmerman being armed, I’m about the second last person who would have any issue with that part. But one does not, and I repeat, NOT, go looking for trouble while armed. You make it come to you, and you do everything you can to avoid allowing it to come to you well before you use the firearm.
The media wants to make this about race and Castle Doctrine, and neither one of them are really relevant, I don’t think.
Starless on March 27, 2012 at 7:37 am said:
One does have to wonder what the media reaction would be if the Aryan Nation offered a large reward for him.
They would make an indignantly outraged demand for a DOJ investigation tout suite, and they’d get one.
(I hate to even bring maggots like that up, but since Spike is already playing in the slime…..)
Comparing Spike Lee to the Aryan Nation…hehe. You better watch it, Mars Blackmon may throw a pair of Nikes at you.
But one does not, and I repeat, NOT, go looking for trouble while armed.
The only issue I have with an unfettered Second Amendment is exactly that. When you have armed nitwits milling around in public, they’re going to find courage in a .45 and feel like they can confront suspicious characters in the dark. I don’t think people like that truly understand the fundamental idea that you have to be prepared to kill whatever you point your weapon at.
The media wants to make this about race and Castle Doctrine, and neither one of them are really relevant, I don’t think.
They’re not. It’s about basic stupidity and crime (but I repeat myself).
unreasonable facsimile on April 2, 2012 at 12:11 am said:
yes, George was armed. But I think based on what was reported weeks ago by 2 different sources, that George was NOT on patrol. Two separate news reports have said that George was on a personal errand (one said on his way to Target), and he had CC license for that weapon, perfectly legal for him to do so (unlike some other people who have guns that are not licensed, that kill people for sport). I think he likely had NO IDEA when he left his house to RUN HIS ERRAND, that he might see someone lurking around, acting like they were “on drugs”.
Folks, it was raining that night. Doncha think that after a walk in the rain to the convenience store, any normal person would want to be getting back to their house QUICKLY, and not just slowly walking around? I think neither the hoodie nor the color of TM’s skin had anything to do with why George thought he was “suspicious”. Fool was walking around outside in the cold and rain, slowly, staring at the houses, and acting weird were George’s FIRST observations and words to the dispatcher…not “mean looking black kid wearing a hoodie that I don’t like”.
Everyone seems to be filtering this thing with known information that neither TM nor GZ had the benefit of knowing prior to the incident. We are all walking back through it with some knowledge we have gathered, some true, some not so true, some just speculation from both sides.
For example. one report said GZ was on his way back to his vehicle and TM came up behind and to his left, and verbally addressed him with something that ranged from “what is your problem” to “whats yer effin problem dude”. If George didn’t want to get into a physical confrontation, then his first response might have been to reach for his cell phone to call 911 back.
Did it ever occured to anyone that if George was reaching for his cell phone, that TM didn’t know he was reaching for a PHONE, and thought he might have been reaching for a gun, and decided that the best thing to do in that situation was to try and keep George from reaching for a weapon? TM had no way of knowing George was actually armed, and George probably had no intention of using it (bear in mind he knows the cops are on their way!!) but if TM attacked out of fear when GZ reached for his phone, then the battle was on….and basically all a big, huge tragedy that was caused because each of them had every good reason to FEAR the other one, and BOTH of those fears were based in racial sterotypes. did you ever just for one minute consider THAT?
edna on April 2, 2012 at 8:07 am said:
This leaves a lot to the imagination, sounds like TV or movies. No 17 year old is going to approach a grown man in a car with just his bear hands. This sounds like trying to justify the shooting GZ had performed. We need to be more considerate and compassionate of others. In addition the shooting doesn’t appeared to have happened at the parking lot. GZ had no physical marks of violence when he was photographed going to the police station.
I belief both may have been fearful, but TM was talking to his girlfriend stating someone was following him and he was fearful of his life. Doesn’t make sense a person fearful of his life walking away fast and scared. Hollering for help (per police tapes) and he decides to confront the person terrorizing him. Maybe we can consider THIS.
Starless on April 2, 2012 at 9:17 am said:
BOTH of those fears were based in racial sterotypes. did you ever just for one minute consider THAT?
Nope.
Maybe you can divine what goes on in the hearts of men, but I know I sure can’t. Maybe George Zimmerman is a Hispanic David Duke and Trayvon Martin shared the same attitudes about race as Calypso Louie Farrakhan, but I wouldn’t know, I’m not going to pretend to know, and I’m not going to be baited into speculating about it.
That’s the point.
You apparently have very strong opinions about this and you are welcome to them. Go ahead and protest or engage in detailed amateur forensics or whatever, but know that all you’re doing is throwing more fuel on the fire. I don’t know the specifics of what happened and I don’t pretend to know, but I do know that you don’t end up with one person dead and another one being prosecuted in the media because of a colossal misunderstanding.
BEB on April 1, 2012 at 4:58 pm said:
Shooting an unarmed person IS murder. He is an adult. Trayvon is was a child.
Pray this idiotic law does not get your kid killed. This boy LIVED THERE…he had every right to be there.Off the radar?? Don’t count on it. I happen to know that there are several cases being looked into. How heartless and cold to you have to be to make the killing of an unarmed kid look insignificant?? Guess religulous rightwing values fly out the window when it comes to the NRA, eh? I am pretty sure that murder is still a sin.
Stop making the death of a child trivial…if it were your child you would see it differently.
Mel1264 on April 1, 2012 at 5:46 pm said:
BEB, again you are incorrect. Trayvon Martin didn’t live there. His father’s girlfriend did. Martin lived in Miami. He was with his father after being suspended from school. You’re right though, he did have every right to be there. It would explain why he was on Zimmerman’s radar though. I think it’s natural to be a little suspicious when it comes to strangers in your neighborhood. Especially when there has been a string of burglaries in the area. Wanting to reserve judgement until all of the facts come out does not equate to trivializing his death.
jefferson101 on April 1, 2012 at 6:53 pm said:
OK. “Shooting an unarmed person is murder.”
When do we start prosecuting about 1,000 Cops a year for murder, then?
Oh, I forgot. They are “Agents of the State”, and the State doesn’t have to play by the same rules the rest of us do, right?
Welcome to 1984, sucker. I hope you like it.
Starless on March 27, 2012 at 8:18 am said:
Interesting overhead graphic via Ace. I’d say that every single MSM account I’ve read about this incident has called the area in which the shooting took place a “gated community”. I don’t know about you, but “gated community” to me suggests large, exclusive, single-family, upper middle-class homes. From the aerial view, it looks like this “gated community” is a tract of modern, probably 1990s or so, townhomes. IOW, the contemporary take on the large apartment building where instead of paying rent for your unit, you pay an overpriced zero-down Adjustable Rate Mortgage.
As Insty would say: #NarrativeFail
Desi Dero on March 29, 2012 at 3:50 am said:
I’m not sure how Obama is “liberal” – most liberals despise him considering how we’re still in Afghanistan, still detaining people and blowing up civilians in the name of saving them, still ignoring the Constitution for targeted assassinations, still didn’t define a national health policy that would lower costs (like the rest of the world has) and improve treatment vs. line insurance company pockets.
Mostly, Obama just took the racial angle without confronting the NRA – probably wise in an election year, but not admirable.
What I find disappointing is it’s 2012 and we make no progress – how do people protect their homes without “profiling” and getting pushed towards “us vs. them” attitudes, including internal racism?
This gated community might have had few blacks (dunno), but how would you run a Neighborhood Watch program in a mixed neighborhood, where you couldn’t use skin color to define a suspicious stranger?
It sounds like Stand and Defend has been used to bad effect by gangbangers themselves – will conservatives ever come to agreement that guns seldom help the situation no matter who’s carrying them, and whipping out a pistol in a heated moment usually causes regrets no matter what the situation?
While showing a menacing 7-year-old mug shot was a nasty trick, and Zimmerman’s half Peruvaian Indian – not “white” or Mexican – why don’t we know the forensics on Zimmerman – did he really have a broken nose? was his head really bloodied? They don’t look that way from the police station video.
Martin’s drug suspension is irrelevant, but the likely stolen jewelry in his pack earlier isn’t. Was he actually messing around looking for something he might steal, or was he just heading back from 7-11 talking to his girlfriend.
Would a skinny 6’3″ kid really jump a stockier 5’9″ man?
Many answers we don’t know.
Glenn on April 1, 2012 at 4:27 pm said:
I think you’re not as unbiased as you say. Trayvon was not digging in any garbage. Even if he was is that an excuse for murder? You are a very deceitful, lying, race-baiting person. Are you a neo-nazi in disguise? I really hope you are not Black, because you are clearly a right wing tool. IMHO
Mel1264 on April 1, 2012 at 5:49 pm said:
How do you know what he was doing Glenn, were you there? Nobody said it was an excuse for murder, just that it was “suspicious” behavior. There is nothing deceitful about what was said and if you want to talk about race-baiting we should probably be having a conversation about Jesse Jackson, Spike Lee, Louis Farrakhan and the racial arsonist himself, the Reverend Al Sharpton!
Keri on April 1, 2012 at 8:31 pm said:
No one really knows what truly happened… But I think it cant be denied that the legal system has not performed in a way the most people would expect in a homicide. I think the idea that people are rushing to judgement is pretty irrelavent…that is nothing new and always happens when a crime is committed. People are bound to form opinions on both sides. This incident just so happened to occur in this digital age where people can post their uncensored opinions in real time and have it seen/heard world wide. I think the fact that so many have voiced their thoughts (in emails, letters, online posts, and demonstrations) shows just how much the issues at the heart of this case touch people.
This should NOT be a racial issue
Selia on April 1, 2012 at 8:34 pm said:
YOU are the biggest racist pimp in this story, McQ!
Dan Collins on April 1, 2012 at 8:51 pm said:
You think?
This matter will go to a Grand Jury, who will consider the evidence. If they think there is sufficient to go to trial, and I think it is likely they will, then it will go to trial. In my opinion, the judge would be foolish to let cameras into the courtroom, but he might, in the interests of “transparency.” Each side will be then permitted to give its case, and the jury to decide.
Considering the stupidity with which people like Spike Lee and Roseanne Barr have treated this, I think it would be good for the jurors to be able to remain anonymous, even as the race-baiting, shark-feeding media try to dig their identities up. People with little to no real interest in the evidence will rally outside to shout slogans, make threats, and generally try to derail the legal process in the interests of “justice.”
When a decision is handed down, if it favors Zimmerman, and even if the evidence is greatly in his preponderance, there will be riots, and people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton will claim that they had no hand in it at all, and all of the folks who believed that heated rhetoric played a part in Gabby Giffords’ shooting at the hands of Jared Loughner will defend them.
So, we shall see.
jefferson101 on April 1, 2012 at 8:59 pm said:
Who is he racist toward? The “White Hispanic”, or the “White African-American”?
If Obama had a son, he’d look like Treyvon, right? That would lead me to conclude that Treyvon is about as “Black” as Zimmerman is “White”, actually. but it’s probably raaaaacist of me to notice that part. It’s always raaaaacist, to hear some folks tell it.
That card, it is overdrawn. Try something else, or no credit for you.
PMG on April 1, 2012 at 9:32 pm said:
I have a few points to make. Point # 1: If you listen to the entire 41 mins of the 911 calls from the night of the killing, you will hear one of the callers, a teacher say that she saw the man with the tee shirt on top of the other man. Now when you look at footage from the crime scene, you see Ziimmerman standing with his hands in his pockets and he has on a tee shirt not a jacket. Trayvon may have been taller than Zimmerman, but Zimmerman was heavier, so it would not have been easy for a 140 pound individual to get a 239 pound person on the ground. Even if Trayvon did get the best out of Zimmerman during a fight, this young man was approached by an unknown individual in the dark who had been chasing him. He was not an officer and did not have a badge, so why wouldn’t Trayvon react? If you were in the same situation wouldn’t you react? The police report stated that Zimmerman had a broken nose and injuries to the back of the head that were so severe that he was bleeding But when you see him at the crime scene surrounded by police, there are no blood stains on the back of his shirt. When you view the tape of him walking into the police station that same night, there are no signs of the injuries that he was supposed to have sustained. Nor are there any bandages which would have been applied by paramedics or other medical personnel to a patient who is bleeding or has such described injuries. The cries of racism would not exist if Zimmerman had been arrested. But when you have an obvious cover up in a city where there is already racial tension and the chief of police already has a past of protecting individuals who perform crimes against African Americans, then yes, you will have the Al Sharptons, and Jessie Jacksons of the world standing up and shouting. Is it right to threaten anyone’s life? Of course not. But the fact is that the public has seen enough evidence to know that Zimmerman should have been arrested on February 27th. That’s what the real problem is. Why are they protecting him, why are they lying for him and why has he not been arrested? Anyone who hears the screams knows that was the sound of a boy not a man. Not only that but the person who would have known without a doubt after hearing those tapes would have been Trayvon’s mother. A mother knows the sound and the cries of her child. There are individuals who are not acting in the correct behavior, I am not justifying giving out Zimmerman’s address, threatening his life, etc because this is wrong, but in a country that has a sad history of racism, and unfair treatment against African Americans what do you expect?
Dan Collins on April 1, 2012 at 10:02 pm said:
On the contrary, it is part of the police report that Zimmerman was treated for his injuries at the scene, and cleaned up in the back of the squad. Even MSNBC has admitted that the video at the police station shows an injury to the back of Zimmerman’s head. And a neighbor came out today in the news saying that he saw Zimmerman’s nose bandaged and swelling around his eyes the day after the shooting.
As regards the voice on the tape, two experts have stated that it couldn’t have been Zimmerman. But . . . do we have audio of Trayvon Martin? It’s said that he was over 6 feet tall, having grown considerably since the time the photos that are generally shown were taken. True, or not? Zimmerman’s brother has a relatively high voice . . . definitely more tenor than baritone, and . . . Mike Tyson? The families are at odds over who’s crying for help. Let the system do its work.
As for the suggestion that there’s bias among the police in Sanford, what is this extraneous evidence that you allude to? I’ve not seen it, and I’ve followed this story rather closely.
The vast majority of violent crimes against black Americans is perpetrated by other black Americans. There is indeed a black genocide, but it is conducted by blacks against blacks for the most part. Neither Jesse nor Al is standing up and saying, “This must stop!” And those victims are every bit as victimized as was Trayvon Martin. A culture of victimization is a culture of exoneration from responsibility, and it harms those most affecting victimization the most.
CW on April 2, 2012 at 11:37 am said:
Not trying to get into any depbate altho i believe the experts when they say Trayvon was the one screaming for help…and also believe it will be proven in a court of law…But I wonder why white people are alway saying they never heard or belive that the racism exist in different sitiuations…IF YOUR NOT BLACK HOW COULD YOU EVER KNOW…YOU ARE NOT THE ONES BEING RACIALLY PROFILED(SO YOU COULD NEVER KNOW) the life of a Black person in America aany more than we could know what Whites go thru with unfarenes. Blacks have been being persecuted for over 400 years,, from Slavery till now.Law inforcement’s unfair treatment and killings..lynchings still happen in 2012…SO THINK OF IT THIS WAY,,IF UR RELATIVES FROM 400 YEARS AGO(SLAVERY) UP UNTIL 2012 HAVE BEEN BEING KILLED NO CHARGES ,TORCHERED ,MURDERED, LYNCHED,RAPED DISCRIMINATED AGAINST ,LEGALLY NOT GIVEN THE EQUAL TREATMENT AS AN AMERICAN AS OTHERS,,,,YOU COME TO A POINT AFTER BEING TREATED THIS WAY FOR OVER 400 YEARS,,,THAT YOU MAKE UP YOUR MIND YOU WILL NOT TAKE ANYMORE…AND BEING FAIR,,,IF A BLACK SECURITY GUARD HAD SHOT A WHITE TEENAGER (WE ALL KNOW) HE WOULD HAVE BEEN ARRESTED AMMEDIATELY….WE ALL KNOW THIS ) EVEN IF ONE DOES NOT WANT TO ADMIT TO IT.WE HAVE TO HAVE MARCHES JUST FOR FAIR TREATMENT..JUST FOR A ARREST WHITE’S DONT .WHAT DOES THAT TELL U.. I AM EDUCATED. AND I DO ALOT OF HISTORY RESEARCH,,,ANYONE THAT DOES NOT BELIEVE THESE STATEMENT CAN DO THE RESEARCH..UNDER HISTORY OF BLACK AMERICANS STARTING 400 YEARS AGO…AND BLACKS ARE STILL BEING TREATED UNEQUAUL
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 11:47 am said:
This is a ridiculous argument, not unlike the one that Toure gave to Piers Morgan about the deep and abiding injury to the American soul. What you are asking for here is not equality, but reparations, borne on the backs of people, like the Zimmermans, who, for all we know, may never have had anything to do with slavery down through the ages. If the lives of black Americans are held so cheaply, and I am afraid that they are, it is because there is so little outrage of the sort that we see expressed over George Zimmerman for all the lives taken by black-on-black violence.
What you are proposing is that the only people fit to sit on a jury to try Mr. Zimmerman are black Americans, because they are the only ones who understand the alleged crime in its proper context. And that proper context somehow drags hundreds of years of history into this trial, while ranting about how Trayvon’s school suspension should never have been brought out in public. It is intellectually vacuous and pernicious to justice to make these claims.
Trayvon’s family, from what I can make out, actually came to the United States via the UK. Whether or not any of their members ever were enslaved, I don’t know, but it does not mean that Trayvon Martin had no moral agency as an individual, and it does not mean that George Martin had a particular duty to consider whether or not Trayvon might have been suffering from some kind of multi-generational post-traumatic stress disorder, and it does not mean that anyone’s feelings, much less any identity group’s, are more important than the facts and the law.
Keri on April 2, 2012 at 9:29 pm said:
The “lives of black Americans are held so cheaply” … okay… (your words). But what does that have to do with black-on- black crime and THIS issue??? It should have nothing to do with this issue. The proper context of this crime should have nothing to do with race and the only people who should sit on the jury are people who can be impartial in evaluating the facts as they pertain to the law. With that being said, if it is reavealed that race was a factor in the reason why Zimmerman was “suspicious” of TM, dont you think that point should be examined?? I wonder, can you even admit that racial profiling exists? Oh and another question… even if TMs family came from the UK (they could have come from Mars for all it matters) What does that have to do with anything? When looking at a black person people may not see their nationality (nor 400 years of oppression for that matter) but they definately can see black.
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 9:40 pm said:
Why don’t you do me the courtesy of reading what I was responding to, then try to make those very same arguments again?
Keri on April 2, 2012 at 10:09 pm said:
I have read all the comments… I’m just trying to understand YOUR points. I personally dont think that race should be an issue in this case but I acknowledge that it was a possible factor. You were the first to mention black-on-black crime… so again why do you feel it relavant to THIS issue? if it is reavealed that race was a factor in the reason why Zimmerman was “suspicious” of TM, do you think that point should be examined. Do you think that racial profiling occurs?
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 10:23 pm said:
I feel that it was made relevant to this issue by the commenter who claimed, in effect, that the matter was a black issue and that we weren’t in a position to comment on it. Well, I’m sorry, but that’s just not so. One is either for one law for all, or anarchy. One is either against all aggression against all, or they are not against violence.
I think racial profiling does occur. That doesn’t mean that it was an element in this case. Remember, it was the police dispatcher who first asked Trayvon Martin’s race, and that that part of the conversation was deliberately obscured in MSNBC’s audio. Now that is much more compelling evidence of profiling than what we have to accuse Martin with.
Remember, I am responding to someone who is making what is essentially a racialist argument, a la Toure. It is an argument that cracks under the strain of scrutiny. If a black life is held cheaply, then it is time to take serious steps from within the black community to change that.
You call me to account for bringing race into this discussion. You ought to know from what’s in front of you that it is not I who did so, nor the writer of this piece. In this case, the proximate cause of my referencing race was the comment to which I was responding. It would not be overstating to say that that comment cast this as an incident primarily and solely of race.
But again: who are the profilers, here?
Jeff Potts on April 3, 2012 at 1:22 pm said:
Even if Blacks had been persecuted for five thousand years it doesn’t make Zimmerman guilty. What would the verdict be? Guilty by reason of historical persecution? Did white people march when O.J. Simpson was found not guilty? What about a black man,Roderick Scoot of New York who killed a seventeen year old teenager? He was found not guilty by a mixed race jury. No matter what the historical context it is only fair that each case be judged on its own merits.
unreasonable facsimile on April 2, 2012 at 12:27 am said:
PMG….if YOU listened carefully to the calls, you would have noticed that the “man in the white t-shirt” on top of the other man happened AFTER the gunshot went off. Listen to it again, and that theory goes out the window.
Two witnesses who went outside after the altercation (not before, and not during) saw GZ ‘straddling’ the teenager, with his hands on his back.
How about the possibility that TM had been shot clean through since it was close range, and George was trying to STOP THE BLEEDING WITH PRESSURE?
no, because that would suggest that GZ was a human being instead of the cold blooded vigilante everyone supposes him to be. This all happened within a matter of less than maybe 15 minutes total, and that is being generous. Where are peoples brains?????
Patrick on April 2, 2012 at 5:08 pm said:
I heard nothing to suggest that he made any attempt to render aid. Where is your source? I also heard nothing about him having visible wounds from anyone besides the police. Have you seen any video or pictures of his injuries? And also, head wounds don’t disappear overnight
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 5:10 pm said:
Yes, there is evidence of head wounds.
understanding mother on April 2, 2012 at 8:36 pm said:
Just for the record they have not confirmed any head wounds. They only said a officer looked @ the back of his head. All the witnesses say the whole altercation took place on GRASS some of u should get your facts before running your mouth no one has pictures they say its on a i phone. What police station does that
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 8:41 pm said:
Sorry, but ABC’s video, previously shown in a compressed format, and used to argue that he appeared uninjured, now shows clearly gashes to the back of his head.
Mel1264 on April 2, 2012 at 9:52 pm said:
NBC News has admitted to editing the tape of the 911 call to portray Zimmerman as saying something that he didn’t. ABC News has admitted that they were wrong about Zimmerman’s injuries. There WERE head wounds. If this is such an open and shut case, why does the mainstream media need to lie and manipulate the truth?
edna on April 2, 2012 at 8:20 am said:
Great job I could not have said this better myself.
Dennis Starr on April 1, 2012 at 9:34 pm said:
I’ve been hearing from friends in South Florida that several law firms in the area are considering joining forces and mounting a massive lawsuit against NBC.on behalf of the victims shot at the funeral home.
Dan Collins on April 1, 2012 at 10:06 pm said:
I don’t believe they will be able to show a direct connection. The young man being sent off at the funeral home jumped to his death trying to evade store security after being pursued for apparently stealing several items. Why this would provoke a gang slaying is anybody’s guess at this point, and I’m not sure what the ‘race’ of the alleged shooters is, because I haven’t seen it reported.
Lafn@u on April 1, 2012 at 9:37 pm said:
I am amazed that this rinky dink news source is the ONLY one reporting that Trayvon was digging through trash cans (never heard it on any other media outlet). I’m almost as amused as I am disgusted. Good way to further assassinate the young boy. How about you report FACTS and not hocus pocus! This is ridiculous. And many of you would be singing a FAR different tune had an innocent white boy been murdered by an overzealous black neighborhood watch “captain”. I’m sure you would not be so impartial then. The race card gets played because the race card still exists. Think about it. In the meantime, you should probably find a hobby that doesn’t involve trolling the internet to spew hate and discontent. Shame on you!
Dan Collins on April 1, 2012 at 10:07 pm said:
Do you know the story, from the Chicago area, of Kelli O’Laughlin? No? Why not?
jefferson101 on April 1, 2012 at 10:17 pm said:
Funny you should mention black folks killing white folks. It happens three or four days a week, on a good week, and all seven on most weeks.
I’ve never put a bounty on anyone yet. Would you feel better if we started acting stupidly in response to stupid actions? Did anyone put a bounty on the killers of Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom? Did we have any more or less reason to do so than exists in this case?
Inquiring minds want to know!
For the record: I have never notably defended Zimmerman, and have been very critical on occasion. But that doesn’t mean that I’m willing to see “justice” based on mob rule in his case, or any other.
O.F. on April 2, 2012 at 12:23 am said:
Bruce, Bruce, Bruce…
Then why didn’t you take the time to research the story? Why do you provide fodder for this “polarization” that you seem to decry– then contribute to with such casual indifference? In actuality, there is nothing “overzealous” in calling in actual suspicious activities that you observe; you’re being overzealous when you observe what the average person would consider normal activities, and you see them as suspicious.
Why insert this gratuitous piece of information that, Martin “…who lived 250 miles away…” I’m curious– if he and his family had just recently moved into the neighborhood; or he had lived 743.8 miles away; or he had just moved to this country from France, what would that add to the facts of the case? How do you come up with Trayvon Martin “…was APPARENTLY acting suspiciously (rummaging through garbage cans, etc.)”, If YOU were a witness to events that night, you need to contact police. If you were not a witness, do not attempt to attribute actions to either party that are purely nothing more than your own imaginative flights of fancy.
How do you logically justify your saying “I doubt that Zimmerman cared one whit what Martin’s skin color was at the time.”, when even Zimmerman’s neighbors who like him say that he was overwhelmingly preoccupied with black youths (that he believed were committing the petty thefts and break-ins in his neighborhood), and overwhelmingly when he made a “suspicious person” call to police, the person was black.
Yes, your lead-in at line 9, “The story, if you’ve taken time to research it,” will unquestionably convince a great many of your readers that they are about to read the completely objective and unbiased comments from someone who did just that. And of course you further realize that having created such an expectation, you were obligated to live up to it.
Denise Ray on April 2, 2012 at 12:05 pm said:
George Zimmerman’s story is forever changing. First it was HIS screams and not Trayvon’s. Then it was HIM on the ground while Trayvon was doing what, again, “slamming his head on the ground and breaking his nose.” NOW experts and video cameras are proving GZ WRONG. The video showed now broken nose and even though cops CLAIMED to have checked GZ for injuries, they couldn’t have been THAT serious. Why not, you ask? BECAUSE THE COPS WEREN’T WEARING GLOVES when they examined him. Now experts are saying that IT IS NOT GZ’S VOICE screaming for help. WOW, like what more do we have to know to realize that this man is LYING and this whole thing is a COVERUP. Okay, let run down some more of what’s been in the papers. GZ called the cops 46/47 times with paranoid tales of suspiscious characters being in his “gated community”. Come on, people; if you’re inside a “gated” community SOMEBODY HAD TO HAVE LET YOU IN! Okay, Trayvon has been suspended from school for having an empty bag of bud. Trayvon has been seen on his FB page with his middle finger up (seriously, you people deem that as “suspicious” behavior?) Trayvon was wearing a hoody. Well, guess what; so do Justin Bieber and a whole bunch of other white boys. Now, back to GZ, who has been ARRESTED (Hello, that’s HIS mugshot in that orange shirt). Funny, though, I don’t believe Trayvon Martin has ever been arrested for anything – much less being arrested for attacking a POLICE OFFICER – LIKE GZ HAS. Let the GZ klan keep coming up with more lies and tales of grandeur on why he was so justified in killing GZ. In the end – GOD WILL PREVAIL in this matter and JUSTICE WILL BE SERVED AGAINST ONE GEORGE ZIMMERMAN!
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 12:15 pm said:
It’s nice to know you’ve made up your mind, Denise.
Jeff Potts on April 3, 2012 at 1:42 pm said:
First of al “Zimmerman’s Story” can only be construed as what he told the police at the time of the incident. Whatever his father or second cousin says is just hearsay. Now Zimmerman did claim that he was hit in the face and head slammed into the ground. That is born out by both the enhanced video tape and the police report. Also a witness at the scene named “John” who was interviewed by a news reporter indicated that it was Trayvon on the top and Zimmerman was on the bottom. He was unequivocal.
The experts who dissected the 911 tape do not have a sample of Trayvon’s voice and can only say that there is a 48% chance of it being Zimmerman’s voice. Why don’t we wait until the police and FBI do their voice analysis.
The gated community had several “holes” in their system and the main gate was easily circumvented. The complex which had about 260 units had the police called out a little over 400 times in the space of 13 months. They were not all called out by George Zimmerman.
I owned a gated apartment building and it is easy to ward off security. Usually at my building a tenant gives a friend or acquaintance the security code and they just punch the keypad and let themselves in.
Trayvon’s Twitter account is full of misogynist remarks and his name is No-Limit-Nigga.
What I found astounding is that anyone with Zimmerman’s background, being the son of a judge would say anything to the police without benefit of counsel if he were guilty. He not only went in for a four or five hour interview after the incident but later the next day he gave the police a reenactment of the happenstance.
If the forensic, voice tape and witness account don’t give with Zimmerman’s voluminous statements then arrest him. But until then he should stay free.
You also keep ranting about Zimmerman’s lies. Okay, which ones are lies? What evidence has contradicted him conclusively or whom? Everyone saw the video from the police garage and said Zimmerman’s guilty. With the new video enhancement is there an apology or retraction from any of these persons?
I just chatted with a friend and she stated categorically that “Trayvon wasn’t on drugs”. She hasn’t nor has anyone else read the toxicology report or autopsy. How can my friend possibly know that? I asked her that question and like many questions that deserve a cogent answer she has become mute.
Let’s stop using phrases like “God Will Prevail”. Many times it does not happen especially for atheists.
Patrick on April 2, 2012 at 4:59 pm said:
This is a case of an idiot with a gun attacking someone he considered a safe target. He got out of his vehicle and chased a child with a gun. Then murdered him in someone’s backyard. I really don’t give a damn about his color, he’s a murderer and needs to be tried for what he did. How many of think he got out with empty hands? Let’s be a little more intelligent than that. How many of you will stand still, while someone with a gun yells at you and threatens you? Any Supermen out there?
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 5:11 pm said:
Boy, you sure have it figured out. Next!
understanding mother on April 2, 2012 at 8:15 pm said:
O most definitely agree. He murdered a child for no reason.
jefferson101 on April 2, 2012 at 8:24 pm said:
How about I come bang your head on a sidewalk a few times and then you tell me he had no reason to shoot the head-banging individual?
Not that I would ever do that, but I will go back to something I said already here. Don’t be starting things that you can’t finish, and don’t depend on the .Gov to protect you if you do.
Ask the folks who decided that the .Gov would rescue them after Katrina, if you would. (Of course, we have a Democrat in office now, so he’d make the Bureaucracy work way faster, right?
)
You folks seem to believe in a Higher Government Power that will come rescue you all when things get bad. I don’t.
understanding mother on April 2, 2012 at 8:46 pm said:
Once again they were only n the grass not concrete. Furthermore i would not try 2 b a officer i would have watched wit my eyes & ears & then i would ve been able 2 let the real police kno what i witnessed IF THE CHILD N THE HOODIE WOULD HAVE DONE SOMETHING.
Rachel Rodriguez on April 2, 2012 at 6:50 pm said:
I had a few questions. You write that Martin was “rummaging through garbage cans.” I have not read that anywhere else, and it does not appear in the 911 call by Zimmerman. Where does that come from? Also, you state that Zimmerman’s mother is “Peruvian and of Indian stock.” While I have heard that she is a Peruvian, I have not read what race she is. She may well be of Indian stock, but she could also be White, Asian, etc. because there are Peruvians that are those races as well. I was just curious how you found that out, because I have not seen anything that suggest what race she is, just her nationality.
jefferson101 on April 2, 2012 at 7:43 pm said:
This comment thread has become pointless.
In spite of any evidence to the contrary, the knee-jerk folks are going to believe whatever they want to. It’s a simple progression.
Zimmerman is white. (We don’t care what color he actually is, we said he’s white, so he’s white!)
Trayvon Martin was Black. (He was pretty much as Black as George Zimmerman is “white”, but liberals use the one drop rule on that, just like the Klan would, so quit quibbling.)
George Zimmerman had a gun. Guns are bad and evil, Mkay?
It’s open and shut. Let’s give him a fair trial and have the hanging on the Courthouse lawn the next morning!
Starless on April 3, 2012 at 8:25 am said:
In their defense, it’s hard to hear anything outside of their own heads when they spend their lives like this.
understanding mother on April 2, 2012 at 8:03 pm said:
First, my prayers goes out 2 the families involved. I personally do not think Zimmerman is a racist. I do believe he is a murderer. I have a son & every time i hear that tape i cry. It hurts my heart 2 kno we r debating if a neighborhood watch member killed a child rather either 1 was black, white, hispanic, red, or blue. That was a child someones baby. When u r a watchman u WATCH & REPORT. You do not follow or take matters n your own hands. It’s true the child did not live there he was on his way back 2 his dads girlfriend house. He was looking around mayb because he didn’t kno the area. The first mistake was the grown man following the child. Secondly u r grown & the watch captain, why not let the child kno that. Mayb he needed directions back 2 the house. It’s so many other ways a grown person with common sense could have handled that. If someone head was smashed on concrete u would need coverage & also photos. Im not a fan of Jesse & Al but the r correct for goin after the police department 4 not doin their job correctly. If self defense is true they should have got the evidence that night. If 1 cop believed it wasn’t he should’ve got the evidence that night. Blood on the side walk or went door 2 door that night. That man father is a judge, previous co-workers says he is over aggressive. Some neighbors said it also. He got into a altercation wit an officer but had only got anger classes. His father is the prosecutor & district attorney’s friend that’s why he never got in serious trouble. He always got pulled out that why he thought this murder was nothing. To the commentor that said we lack dads n our homes yes that’s true but that alone proves that that child was glad 2 have his dad n his life so believe me he wouldn’t have started a fight wit a grown man in his father neighborhood. If someone followed u while its dark & u n another neighborhood would u start a fight? No teenager would. Zimmerman wanted 2 b a officer he didn’t past the test why? Why not shoot n the leg or arm? Why scream 4 help then stop once the shot fired. If im screaming 4 help then i shoot someone ill b still screaming or whining especially after shooting someone. Everyone should open up their eyes their minds their hearts. Before we kno it everyone will be killing everyone
Dan Collins on April 2, 2012 at 8:07 pm said:
You clearly don’t care enough for the evidence to learn it.
I’m getting really tired of concern trolls.
understanding mother on April 2, 2012 at 8:20 pm said:
R u lookin @ the evidence? This man killed a child because he thought he was looking suspicious.
understanding mother on April 2, 2012 at 8:27 pm said:
Sometimes i wonder about people. If it was your child,nephew,cousin or brother u would look @ it correctly. I did my research maybe u should.
jefferson101 on April 2, 2012 at 9:23 pm said:
My child, nephew, cousin, or brother? I have all of the above, and Grandsons, too. I’d hope that their Parents, Aunts and Uncles, My Aunts and Uncles, or my own Mother and Daddy would have taught them better.
Play the sad song on that Harp, Darling. It gains you nothing. I have a few Nephews, Nieces, and Cousins who don’t have sense, but I already know they don’t. I hope and Pray that they don’t come to a bad end, but if they do manage to, I won’t be surprised.
And I sure as Hell will go kick the posterior of any of my relatives who tries to trademark their names after they do get that stupid.
I’ve got more sympathy for most Dogs that get shot by the Cops than I do for most of the fools who go get themselves killed by being an arrogant fool with the wrong person, which is about what happened in this case.
Wait until it all comes out, then tell me about it. In the meantime, quit letting your alligator mouth outweigh your hummingbird butt, because I suspect that there will eventually be video. There always is, any more.
Want to bet on the outcome when that comes out?
Jeanne on April 3, 2012 at 12:17 am said:
First of all,Trayvon may not have lived in the area, but had every right to be there. Second,Zimmerman was following him not the other way around,so how could he all of a sudden come up behind Zimmerman to do this horrendeous so-called attack?Third, the eye witness never said (period!) that it was Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. What he said was it was to dark out to tell who was on top of who.Next, the witness did say that all of this did happen on the GRASS not CONCRETE.If Zimmerman was treated by the paramedics did they also give him a clean shirt that they just so happened to have in the ambulance? NO BLOOD AT ALL PEOPLE!! As far as the video, they did not say there was a gash to the back of his head, they said it looked like an indentation. If there was such damage to Zimmerman then where are the pictures of the wounds that the police are alway’s supposed to take when there is any kind of confrontation between anyone. I guess we just take they’re word for it, huh? I believe that one thing for sure that forensics will show is how the bullet entered Trayvon’s body. That definately will show who was on top.Oh, wait!! Kid in morgue on slab, homemade vigilante at home watching t.v. Zimmerman definately on top. I don’t think this is a racial issue at all.I think someone started spewing that and the rest jumped on the bandwagon like good little followers should do. I believe (don’t know) as NONE of us do, that big man had gun wasn’t threatened at all, kid scared half out of his mind being in new neighborhood and stranger following him, stranger tries to take on kid ,kid swings, big man tries to level the playing field with gun vs. tea and skittles . Guess who won that war? For the record, Trayvon might have been 6’3, but he was only 140lbs. (toothpick) Zimmerman may only have been 5’9-5’10, but 240 lbs. (linebacker) Linebacker crushed toothpick!! I would hate to think should anyone else out there send they’re child to the store, how many other Zimmerman’s are out ther lying and waiting for the perfect opportunity to strike just because you’re child looked suspicious.That’s a hell of a reason to die. Burn you’re hoodies people and get a driver’s license, and God forbid if you walk in a neighborhood that you don’t live in, you’ll be signing you’re own death warrant. I also believe that an arrest should be made and all evidence be brought out, then trial. If that would of happened in the first place ther probably wouldn’t be all of this hate talk that’s going on now. The police were too quick to arrive at they’re own opinion as to what happened without seizing all evidence. If George Zimmerman should recieve a fair trial, shouldn’t the same be done for Trayvon and his family? I hope and pray that somehow both families will be able to find peace when all is said and done,but it’s highly unlikely when there are so many more people out there screaming for more blood. Leave race out of this. This is about a dead child, killed with or without reason and the truth needs to be found if for no other reason for the families involved.
Dan Collins on April 3, 2012 at 7:39 am said:
A child, armed only with a bag of Skittles, takes on a man who has a gun, right?
The key piece of evidence? Skittles.
understanding mother on April 3, 2012 at 8:00 am said:
Well said & old man that THINKS that Child was PROBABLY up 2 kno good ill pray 4 u & your family. I hope no1 sends their child down your block cause we all kno the outcome
Dan Collins on April 3, 2012 at 8:27 am said:
Just amazing. Let’s stereotype everyone to our satisfaction, then build a case on our idea of verisimilitude, then complain about profiling.
They were individuals. There is evidence. Use it.
Enoch_Root on April 5, 2012 at 10:15 am said:
http://www.conservativecommune.com/2012/04/more-than-murder-luxury-politics/
Meanwhile.
dawn on March 5, 2013 at 7:45 pm said:
Hey everybody – Zimmerman was a volunteer neighborhood watch person. Why the F did he have a gun on him in a gated community? The dispatcher told him to hang tight until they got there and he didn't. Stop making this out to be the fault of the dead kid. He probably thought Zimmerman was suspicious and wanted to protect himself too – but we'll never know because HE'S dead.
dawn on March 5, 2013 at 7:56 pm said:
Hey – is everyone missing the biggest point here? Zimmerman was a volunteer neighborhood watch person with a gun, in a gated community. What neighborhood watch person carries a gun? Oh yeah, ones looking for a problem and bored because there isn't one. Martin was visiting his family in an unfamiliar neighborhood and getting confronted by some strange dude probably ordering him around. How the F would you react in that same situation? We'll never know what Martin was thinking or why he did what he did because he's DEAD. From an overzealous, gun toting, neighborhood watch volunteer loser.
And if Zimmerman had time to call the cops then he had time to WALK AWAY FROM THE KID AND STOP FOLLOWING HIM and wait until the POLICE ARRIVED.
And if he couldn't tell the color of his skin how could he tell if he was on drugs? Maybe Martin was listening to his headphones and was moving to the music and wasn't very good at it.
Bottom line, Zimmerman wasn't a cop. He wasn't trained to make judgement calls or identify anything about anybody. He was told to call the police and wait until they arrived. Instead, he thought back to his Law & Order training and pretended he was a hero.
And if he's allowed to get away with this then it won't matter who you are or what you're doing in FL you'll be able to shoot someone and kill them and claim it was in self defense. Even when you're a ZERO volunteer neighborhood watch person toting a gun in a gated community.
Wake up people.
Starless on March 6, 2013 at 7:04 am said:
Yeah, WAKE UP PEEPUL!
it won't matter who you are or what you're doing in FL you'll be able to shoot someone and kill them and claim it was in self defense
It'll be like the Wild, Wild West, only in Florida! Only with more retirees!
neighborhood watch volunteer loser
ZERO volunteer neighborhood watch person
Keep that in mind, everyone. If you're thinking of volunteeering for neighborhood watch, don't do it! Otherwise, you'll be an uncool loser ZERO.